Friday, April 13, 2007

LAN accredited courses

Read this story in the Star today in regards to registering for courses which are accredited by LAN (Lembaga Akreditasi Negara) or the National Accreditation Board. I quickly checked the LAN website, and was pleasantly surprised to find that they have a list of accredited courses by institution online. You can find it here and here.

I'm still a little unsure as to what happens if someone takes a 'provisionally' / accredited / approved course and finds out at the end of his or her 3 years of taking this course that this course didn't make it to the fully accredited list.

I was also surprised to find a lot of PHEIs (Private Higher Educational Institutions) which I've never heard before appearing on this list. (Maybe an issue for a future post)

But at least we can access this information online to check if a particular course in a particular institutions is accredited or not, which is what most students would do in this day and age.

36 comments:

Anonymous said...

The trouble is many students would still register even when they know the courses are unrecognised as in the case of TARC. Then they start complaining about not being able to work in the govt.

Anonymous said...

Agree, like most of the 3+0 engineering programmes are not recognised by BEM/IEM/EAC but students still loving to go for them. Why?

The Student.

Clayton J.C Tan said...

Why are people still enrolling in courses that are not recognized by LAN? The answer is simple ...

When I was deciding my path during my form, I had a choice between STPM, A-Lvls, Pre-U Programmes or Diploma. My final goal was straight-forward - I want to graduate as soon as possible with a degree recognized by the INDUSTRY.

Realize I emphasized that it's the INDUSTRY recognition that I look for and not LAN. At those days, there were much talk by the government about trying to stop "fast track degrees", 3 year degrees ... etc. I admit I was one of those that did a fast track and completed within less than 4 years after SPM, despite the risk of being not recognized by LAN.

Now let's ask ourselves - What's our objective upon graduation? If you want a challenge, it's in the private sector; if you are looking for high salary, Malaysian Government doesn't pay that well; if you wanna develop yourself, I'd advise that you join the private sector; but if you just want an easy 9-5 job that pays based on seniority and promote based on kulitfication, maybe join the government.

So if that is the case. There is no law that says private sector can only hire graduates from LAN accredited courses, why not just take up any course that the industry wants? After all, we graduate and join the industry.

Maybe someone should do a survey on employer satisfaction and tell us if those graduates from LAN accredited courses are favoured?

Clayton J.C Tan said...

On a separate note, I was just wondering (not too sure if I understood the concept of LAN well).

Is it true that only graduates from LAN accredited courses can work for the Government? Only graduates from LAN accredited courses can futher their studies in local universities?

If the above is true, does this apply to foreign degrees too? Tell me if a person can work for the government with the following scenario.

1 - If one enrolled in a 3+0 (not LAN accredited) and graduated with a foreign degree.
2 - If one went overseas but to the same university that a local college here offers the 3+0 degree.
3 - If one went overseas to Harvard or Cambridge.

If there are not accredition for foreign universities - First of all, isn't scenario 1 and 2 of about the same standard? And would scenario 2 and 3 bring the same outcome?

Should that also mean that a Harvard graduate will not be able to serve the government as a degree holder?

This is getting confusing, someone enlighten me.

Clayton J.C Tan said...

Another interesting point to note.

I don't seem to find any of the doctorate courses of Open University Malaysia in any of the list (Approved, Provisional, Accredited).

OUM have been advertising 5 doctorate courses lately, does it mean all these courses are not recognize by the Malaysian Government? But I thought OUM is established by a combination of Public Universities in Malaysia?

Anonymous said...

Clayton:
After reading many comments in this blog and elsewhere, this is my understanding. LAN is for recognising courses by private colleges/universities. JPA is responsible for govt employment. If LAN does not recognise then JPA would not recognise as well. So, you just have to work in the private sector.
As for your (1), (2), and (3) scenarios, a good example is TARC's program with Campbell and UK Universities. Because of conflicting interpretation by TARC, it does not believe that it should answer to LAN. So, recognition by LAN is out of question. Now, JPA does not recognise TARC's Campbell/UK degrees done at TARC and top-up at UK for govt employment and postgrad studies. That is your (1) scenario. But if you go to Campbell University in the US and get a degree there, JPA will recognise that as a general degree here (lower salary than honours). Likewise if you enrol in Sheffield Hallam or Liverpool John Moore Universities in UK (TARC's partners) and get a honours degree there, it will be recognised by JPA. Make sure to check JPA's interactive website. So, that means your scenario (2) and (3) are the same because they are both overseas. In summary, going overseas to get the degree is not the same as getting the degree locally even if the degree-granting university is the same because the local ones have to be approved by LAN. That is logical because facilities and instructors are different.
If I am wrong, others can chip in.
You said that you don't care whether it is LAN recognised or not. That is OK if you don't intend to apply to local public universities or even UTAR for postgrad studies or to join the govt.

Anonymous said...

Claton J C Tan,...
Are you somehow related to Abraham Lincoln?

Muahahaha...

Anonymous said...

I don't understand why some students just want to suffer pain. Why do you plan to start your career with a handicap? Instead of starting at par you start one step behind others? That is what you do when you take a degree course that is not recognised. In your youthful optimism, you can claim now with arrogance that you don't need govt job, which can be teaching, tax auditor, etc. That is a big employment sector to turn away from. Don't use that argument about kulitfication when you already started on your path to an unrecognised degree. The private sector is also not stupid to just take any Tom, Dick, and Harry, with a degree, especially an unrecognised one. They start you off with a lower salary and you think everything is honky-dory.

Anonymous said...

On more thing to add to the above...you may one day decide to do a postgrad diploma or degree at a local public university and then you start screaming of unfair treatment when they reject your unrecognised degree.

Clayton J.C Tan said...

Anon 4/14/2007 06:30:00 PM
- Don't get you, what has this got to do with Lincoln? Is there a joke here that I don't understand?

Anon 4/15/2007 12:45:00 AM
- Not too sure what are you trying to imply here. Not trying to boast here I'm confortably employed since the day of graduation in a fortune top 20 company. The industry DOES recognize my degree and I believe I've been started with a salary on par if not higher than many from so called LAN accredited degrees.

Just some clarification:
- What I said just now was "the risk of not being accredited" because of rumours. The institution was then already very well accepted in the industry by then. Anyhow, it eventually got accredited after all.
- I'm just trying to say that not LAN accredited doesn't mean the course is bad. At the end of the day, it's a matter of what you've eventually learn and how you developed yourself. That's what the industry wants after all.

So for all the TARC graduates out there, be proud of yourselves that you've had the determination to pursue higher education. If JPA doesn't recognize, the industry does. *By the way I am not a TARC graduate*

Anonymous said...

Hey potential students,
Do a thorough check on any IPTS that you may wish to enroll in. I have reason to believe that LAN accreditation does not solely reflect on the true quality of a course of study in any institution. It merely shows that the syllabi, credit requirements, teaching staff etc of the course does meet the requirements of LAN. It is not difficult to get accreditation, just do the paperwork according to LAN's stipulations. What comes after?? Your guess is as good as mine!

ruyom said...
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vesewe said...
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Anonymous said...

What happened to the discussions here? Appeared to be hijacked by others talking about out-of-topic issues unrelated to LAN. They all started from ruyom (4/15/2007 03:32:00 AM) bragging about his wife in San Francisco to anonymous of (4/15/2007 09:24:00 AM) complaining about UMNO and the PM. It is fishy that these postings appeared together at about the same time.

Anonymous said...

Tony,
I think I agree with Anon above, there are some fishy people trying to hijack your blog.

May be they are sponsored by some polital parties to sabotage yr blog...

ledzeppelin4evr said...

Why are some degree courses from prominent PHEIs, such as Taylor's and Monash University not listed? Does that mean I have no chance at working for the gov at all? Geez...

Anonymous said...

Regarding the non-recognised diploma / degree in TAR College, here is some info. These are real info.

If you get a degree from Campbell, you will enter the market at about the same rate as the degree from a local public university. Here I'm talking about degree for degree comparison, i.e. B Sc. Computer Science vs B Sc. Computer Science.

Note that you do not enter the private sector at lower pay compared to graduates from local public universities. The students from Tarc have proved to be brilliant, hard working and very competitive.

First of all, the government does not force the private sector to have such pay quota. Secondly, why would the private sector want to pay someone slightly higher if we know the graduates quality is not higher (in fact quite a number from local public universities is even lower in quality due to the government quota in admiting students)? Thirdly, this is an open fact the industries know about.

As for the technical diploma from TAR College, you will enter the market at lower pay compared to degrees. But, slightly higher compared to the same diploma from other colleges. The standards of the diploma as equivalent to the Engineering Council, UK, part II
Exams, despite JPA recognition, is a fact the private industries know about. However, a diploma is still a diploma, it will limit your path to higher management in a company.

As for working in the government sector, if that is your choice, you should go for a diploma or degree acredited by the government.

One very common mistake youngsters usually made is they do not have a clear direction of what they really wanted in their career until they graduated, most ended up in the wrong course or wrong institutions.

amir said...

As for those doing engineering courses that is not recognized by LAN, then they will not be able to register with BEM. So you cannot be a practicing engineer (Ir).

Anonymous said...

So, after reading all the comments, is TARC/Campbell University recognised by LAN?. I wonder.........

Anonymous said...

Here for all of you, "the TARC /Campbell University Graduates" out there, ONE OF YOU has just ruin my confidence in TARC/Campbell graduates honesty /integrity, found out she lied in applying to get the job.

Anonymous said...

Anon of 4/24/2007 08:37:00 PM:
TARC/CAmpbell is not recognised by LAN and JPA. See the posting by anon (4/14/2007 03:18:00 AM) in reply to Clayton's question.

Anonymous said...

Hi Anon (4/24/2007 08:43:00 PM):

Welcome to the real world of recruiting. You are not the only one coming across lying job applicants.

April 26, 2007's TodayOnline.com article "Asians on the job hunt, armed with lies" by
Loh Chee Kong..

"..Among the three Asian countries surveyed, the concern over dishonest candidates is greatest in Malaysia (89 per cent), followed by Hong Kong (80 per cent) and Singapore (70 per cent).

In Malaysia, seven in 10 respondents also said they had met such candidates, as compared to 62 per cent in Singapore and 54 per cent in Hong Kong..."

Maybe you should expand a bit on why you got disappointed.

Anonymous said...

Hi all,
Lets have a look at our MoHE website:http://graduat.mohe.gov.my/kpgv3/ it stated that TARC is IPTA. If I am not mistaken IPTA does not require to get accreditation from LAN right? Correct me if I am wrong.

Stumbled Upon said...

Ahaa, the first anon talked about TARC, and there everybody started discussing about the institution :-) "Same head", huh?

Well, I think I do mind about LAN approval and JPA recognition... it's important and useful to have these elements no matter you want to work on a private sector or something like SPA.

But I don't want to talk any further (because I just don't know)... one last thing is, I believe amongst the best IPTS to consider are UTP (Universiti Teknologi Petronas), UNITEN (UNIversiti TEnaga Nasional), MMU (MultiMedia University, or Universiti Multimedia), Monash University (Selangor), and Curtin University of Technology (Sarawak). Nope, I didn't arrange in order - mana tau, you think so kan? :P

Thanks and what's up with those "This post has been removed by a blog administrator." yah? Spam or what?
For those who don't know...
- TARC = Tunku Abdul Rahman College, or Kolej Tunku Abdul Rahman (KTAR)
- LAN = Lembaga Akreditasi Negara (bukan Local Area Network aaa)
- JPA = Jabatan Perkhidmatan Awam
- SPA = Suruhanjaya Perkhidmatan Awam (bukan SPA tempat mandi-manda aaa)
- IPTS = Institut Pengajian Tinggi Swasta

P.S. Sorry for "the" jokes, nothing harm - just a bit bored right now.

Anonymous said...

do anyone know wat will hapen if the course only provisionally accreditted??is it possible tat it will bcum fully accredited after a few years while i study??my course is 4 years...and wat will hapen if its only provisionaly accredited??does it means tat we cant work in government?

Mr. Vandetta said...

Good discussion here, maybe I can interrupt?

Actually I have a Diploma from Politeknik. It's Diploma in Electronic Engineering (Computer) and now I'm furthering my studies in Degree of IT at MMU Cyberjaya and now I'm in second year, got 2 more years to go.

I have problem. There's 3 semester per year in MMU and I got half loan and it covers only for 2 semesters and for the other semester my parents will pay the fees. My parents can afford it but I feel pity to them and it's hard for me to encourage myself and it towards me to think that should I work and taking degree as part time?

And if my decision is YES I'm interested in OUM courses either Degree of Education w/ Honours or Degree of IT and Managemet and I would like to know which one has better prospect for my future? Going to take it at KL campus or my hometown campus, Kota Bharu.

sudar said...

IS THE DEGREE COURSE AT GLYNDWR UNIVERSITY UK IN AIRCRAFT MAINTENANCE ENGINEERING LAN accredited courses?

Anonymous said...

i would like to know about the status about the recognition of all international degree program by the goverment including the? is there any law stated that all international degree program will be recognize by the goverment?

Anonymous said...

so how do you check the uni/college? The website itself cant be access.